the dangers of unpasteurized milk???

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11 years 6 months ago #440811 by cowvet

llvonn;440307 wrote:

I agree with cowvet in that raw milk can be dangerous, if contaminated. I disagree that it is always contaminated. Good hygiene practices can minimise contamination issues. I get my milk from a farmer who regularly gets his milk independently tested and it has always come back with clean results. It is up to each person to do their research and make an informed decision they are happy with.

No one forces anyone to drink raw milk, be we do have the right to make our own decisions. Our dairying situation is far different to that in america or in Europe where much is industrialised and cows are fed predominantly grain based diets. Unfortunately in NZ we are slowly going the same way with increased stock, leading to increased supplementary grain feeds all chasing increased profits. If anything will damage our reputation internationally, I believe it will be this. Free range, grass fed dairy is a far better selling point than industrialised farming.


Have you ever looked at the filter socks on the farm you get your milk??? You should. ALL milk has bacteria in it. Impossible to get raw milk without bacteria in it. I assure you that if there is any green or fibrous matter on the filter sock (and there always is) then there will be E coli in the milk!

I challenge you to look at the filter socks next time you get your milk. I work on brand new farms with brand new gear and good healthy cows. Some of them are so clean it looks like you could eat your dinner off the milking platform....but they still have bacteria in their milk.

Explaining debt and making a living for these businesses as to why they feed supplements is a whole different topic. If farmers aren't making a profit and paying their bills then this country is down the gurgler.


I love animals...they're delicious

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11 years 6 months ago #440828 by llvonn

cowvet;440320 wrote: You should. ALL milk has bacteria in it. Impossible to get raw milk without bacteria in it.

But not all bacteria is bad. There is bacteria everywhere. Pasteurisation kills the bacteria - yes, but both good and bad. Those who choose to drink raw milk should know this, but we choose to drink raw milk because it contains good bacteria which aren't available in pasteurised milk.

People buy yogurt because it contains acidophilus and bifidus both of which are bacteria. It is often recommended when people take antibiotics because the medicine kills both good and bad bacteria. Bacteria are essential for life and for health.

www.nytimes.com/2012/06/14/health/human-...?pagewanted=all&_r=0

Cowvet I know we differ on opinion and will never agree regarding the consumption of raw milk. Yes, there are risks to drinking raw milk, anyone who says otherwise is either lying, or have not done their research properly. However there is just as much risk in consuming a variety of foods available at the supermarket that the food and medical community do not go out of their way to warn about as they do with raw milk.

1 Border Terrier, 5 hens, 5 chicks, an orchard and vege garden. All on 350 square metres.

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11 years 6 months ago #440833 by Cinsara

cowvet;440273 wrote: Do we want to go back to the infant mortality rates and life expectancy of 50-60 years ago when people were dying from preventible disease?


One sick little girl does not a regression make.

>

Save the Earth... it's the only planet with chocolate!

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11 years 6 months ago #440836 by Ruth

llvonn;440338 wrote: ... we choose to drink raw milk because it contains good bacteria which aren't available in pasteurised milk. ...

Please name them. This is something regularly argued, but what are the good bacteria?

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11 years 6 months ago #440846 by llvonn

Ruth;440349 wrote: Please name them. This is something regularly argued, but what are the good bacteria?

lactose-digesting Lactobacilli bacteria may allow people who traditionally have avoided milk to give it another try. I know several people who were considered to be lactose intolerant but can drink raw milk without any side effects. (It is interesting to note that they are attempting to use genetic modification to obtain this result)

Raw milk also contains the enzyme phosphatase that helps in the absorption of calcium.

One NZ cheese maker once said that it was frustrating that pasteurisation was required for cheesemaking as this made an inferior product. The french are well known for their raw milk cheeses and have been fighting to retain the right to continue this practice. The various bacteria in the milk add flavour to the cheese. In both France and Germany you can purchase raw milk in stores.

1 Border Terrier, 5 hens, 5 chicks, an orchard and vege garden. All on 350 square metres.

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11 years 6 months ago #440855 by wandering free
I think it comes down mass produced milk production verses small scale farming of a few cows were the milk is delivered the same day it's produced.

Milk from the local farm wasn't TT test or pasteurized but was delivered every morning from that mornings milking, straight from a milk churn on the back of a horse and cart, none of us got TB or suffered any ill effects.

Just me and the cat now, on 2 acres of fruit and veg + hazel nuts, macadamia, chestnuts and walnuts,
www.youtube.com/user/bandjsellars?feature=mhee

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11 years 6 months ago #440856 by Stikkibeek
Pasteurisation spelled the end of a really good cheese factory in Waimamaku. Aside from the jobs lost in the small community, we lost the beautiful cheese they used to make. I expect that happened throughout NZ, and it was not to do with the bacteria as such, but rather the move to prevent TB as testing was neither widespread, nor was it compulsory back then

Did you know, that what you thought I said, was not what I meant :S

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11 years 6 months ago #440859 by Ruth

llvonn;440360 wrote: lactose-digesting Lactobacilli bacteria may allow people who traditionally have avoided milk to give it another try. I know several people who were considered to be lactose intolerant but can drink raw milk without any side effects. (It is interesting to note that they are attempting to use genetic modification to obtain this result)

Raw milk also contains the enzyme phosphatase that helps in the absorption of calcium....

Thank you. :)

wandering free;440369 wrote: ...none of us got TB or suffered any ill effects.

Some people did; that was the problem!

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11 years 6 months ago #440866 by LongRidge
wandering free, I had a friend, now dead, that caught tb from cows milk. Fortunately I did not have to undergo the health problems that he did.
But I did catch Type 1 (insulin dependent) Diabetes from over-pasteurised milk .... but that was because the cows the milk was collected from had beta- A1 casein. If they had been A2 cows I would have got neither an infection nor diabetes.
As for goats, I suspect they are not able to spread tuberculosis, brucellosis, leptospirosis, or some of the other diseases that cows can. Thus, I consider that pasteurisation of cows milk will be required for ever (to reduce the health risks), but it seems highly unlikely to be needed for goats milk, except to get rid of the coliforms ie those bugs that kill quickly.
Not pasteurising is a bit like walking across a road without looking for vehicles. You might be able to get away with it forever and live a healthy life. But then, you might not .... and you don't know if the accident will be soon or later, or if it will kill you or just cause a bit of temporary distress. The risks make it a worthwhile task to undertake, as with pasteurisation.

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11 years 6 months ago #440873 by cowvet

wandering free;440369 wrote: I think it comes down mass produced milk production verses small scale farming of a few cows were the milk is delivered the same day it's produced.

Milk from the local farm wasn't TT test or pasteurized but was delivered every morning from that mornings milking, straight from a milk churn on the back of a horse and cart, none of us got TB or suffered any ill effects.


to the contrary - todays milk is of a higher quality.

herds are tested and their staus known with regard to TB. Commercial farms are tested on a DAILY basis with regard to milk quality issues (including hygiene issues). Milk is refridgerated and stored on farm and picked up daily...and there is hygiene monitoring and shed audits on a regular basis.
As an industry we have the best raw milk quality in the world. We are an export nation so all the more reason we are looked at for food safety issues


I love animals...they're delicious

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11 years 6 months ago #440878 by katieb
with regards to TB etc, we are lucky to live in a country where there is a lot of knowledge of diseases & how to control/prevent/get rid of them

In Chile dairy farming is taking off & they are working to get rid of/control TB... some farms are TB farms & employees wear masks while milking. As far as I know you cant buy bottles of 'fresh' milk there, its all long life or powder

Animals rule our place... cows, calves, sheep, goats, pigs, horses, donkeys, chickens, ducks... the list goes on
...."lifestyle block like" 25 or so acres around the house attached to a rather large farm with dairy drystock & a 600 cow dairy conversion :)....1500 acres to call home

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11 years 6 months ago #440911 by wandering free
I thought TB was primarily an airborne disease, we were taught spitting spread TB as it dried and then became airborne. a friend of my mothers died from it (1950) but they had lived in poor conditions during the war, and some families seem to have less resistance to it. If we make life to sterile and protected we're in danger of breeding out hundreds of years of acquired immunity.

Just me and the cat now, on 2 acres of fruit and veg + hazel nuts, macadamia, chestnuts and walnuts,
www.youtube.com/user/bandjsellars?feature=mhee

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11 years 6 months ago #440925 by cowvet
I don't believe in sanitising ever surface we will come in contact with - but I do believe people should have access to safe food and water.


I love animals...they're delicious

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