New Laws for Trademan ?

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12 years 1 month ago #30759 by billmckinstry
Saw on TV recently where from 1st March we must have a Tradesman do any work that required Consent :confused:

My understanding of Consent is a Building Permit.

A Building Permit is req'd eg a simple deck that is 1 mtr above ground level.

What happened to Owner Builders in NZ?

Is this yet another example of Govt (Nanny State) protecting us ??

A large part of the NZ's population would be more then capable of building a deck.

Consent would mean plans are approved and inspectors must ensure they are followed so why must we then pay for a tradsman ?

If my fears are correct I can see an increase in illegal work being done as the cost of it being Legal has just gone up considerably.

How did our recent ancesters survive without all thses rules and regulations ?

NZ used to have a reputation for quality housing until the Govt increased the rules and staarted to tell Tradsman how they Should build and then Leaky Buildings happened (I think ??) Leaky buildings were never a big issue until the 80's construction period.

We used to have a Building Code for residential but no longer ??

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12 years 1 month ago #414549 by pisa
Replied by pisa on topic New Laws for Trademan ?
Yes, a new law, which does have the option to apply for an exemption for DIYers.

buildingguide.co.nz/building-guide/what-...n-you-need-a-builder

1 hubby, 2 kids, 1 cat, 1 dog, 2 swallows and I've lost count how many offsprings with even more grandkids, 5 bunny girls, 5 bunny boys, 12 chickens (rooster, pullets, chicks and more about to hatch hopefully) and 4 goats with two of them expecting any day! (24.10.14)
But who's counting [;)]...

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12 years 1 month ago #414558 by billmckinstry
Thanks Pisa, It appears the TV add is misleading as it says any work requiring Consent must be done by a Tradsman.

Appreciate the link. Most informative.

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12 years 1 month ago #414571 by RhodeRed
Replied by RhodeRed on topic New Laws for Trademan ?

billmckinstry;411142 wrote:
NZ used to have a reputation for quality housing until the Govt increased the rules and staarted to tell Tradsman how they Should build and then Leaky Buildings happened


Leaky building happened because the nanny-state palmed off advisory on building materials and practices to people that had a commercial interest in importing and onselling certain building products.

Naturally in these situations certain people were happy to sign off on their materials their companies where importing regardless of the suitablity of these products for NZ conditions and the fact that these products they spec'd as "OK" later contributed to the whole leaky-home syndrome.

Government can do very little for you except charge you for "services" you don't require and in all likely hood don't want.

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12 years 1 month ago #414585 by Hawkspur
Replied by Hawkspur on topic New Laws for Trademan ?
One odd thing is that many apartment buildings and all commercial work are not covered by this legislation...so anyone can work on those.:rolleyes:

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12 years 1 month ago #414608 by billmckinstry
In the old days we looked to products being tested by BRANZ but I was away from PNG from 1980 to 2011 and not up to date with changes.

There used to be a building code that could be used for such things as what size timber to span a certain distance for a floor joist etc.
I understand this is no longer available but you can get a large folder costing $00's with the ins and outs of the regulations. May need an Engineer to interpret the document.

Old buildings had an eave and windows seldom leaked. New buildings don't have eaves and tax payers cover the cost of the failure so a politician can be re elected:confused:

Old bathrooms seldom rotted and if the did were easy to repair. New ones were (are ?) built with materials (above post) that may well not last the distance.

I feel for the poor people in Christchurch caught in the middle of this bs that are told their house is no longer livable by a public servant.

The Engineer that built his house to withstand liquidfaction and it did, was still told he could not remain there ?

Ground has been deemed unsafe to build on yet the families have been forced to stay in damaged houses for 12 months now, or longer, but are told they can not stay there for ever ??
They were delayed just long enough for the vacant section prices to increase:(

I know my rant is diverging but it is still directed at the Nany State / Building Laws. :)

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12 years 1 month ago #414635 by Hawkspur
Replied by Hawkspur on topic New Laws for Trademan ?
The building laws were changed to be less "nanny state" allowing people to do whatever they chose, as long as it worked. Unfortunately, this, combined with poor requirements for proof of things working (including BRANZ testing), less on the job training, and the promotion of new materials and methods, led to widespread use of poorly tested methods, and resulted in many leaks and even more rot...
So now more prescriptive methods are being brought in again...

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12 years 1 month ago #414652 by billmckinstry
Thanks Hawkspur. Why did the Govt decide tax payers should repair peoples homes ? Or was this just a vote buying stunt ?

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12 years 1 month ago #414660 by Hawkspur
Replied by Hawkspur on topic New Laws for Trademan ?
I guess that would always be a part of any governments decision making, unfortunately, but I think part of the reason is that it was/is in effect a systemic failure. Blame for a complex thing is very hard to apportion fairly, and what was needed was a solution, more than blaming.

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12 years 1 month ago #414768 by alpac
Replied by alpac on topic New Laws for Trademan ?
BRANZ is one of the biggest failures in the history of NZ building their incompetence and their failures have contributed a fair share to the current problems.
The leaky homes and other problems have been caused by using designs for which the tradespeople and architects didn't have the required know how. Poor building design is another cause of trouble e.g. most houses get water ingress if a roof tile is cracked or a little hole in the iron.
Often this gets discovered only once the ceiling is wet (to late raelly)
In Europe for example a sub roof is standard for a long time now. If the actual roof has a leak the sub-roof drains the water of and it is dripping down just behind the gutter and one can see that the roof needs some attention before any damage is done.
Alone this little thing could save millions of repair costs each year in NZ.
The construction of a modern healthy and energy efficient homes requires a high level of skills. Thanks to a high influx of European tradespeople and the products they introduced such as real functioning and insulating windows some progress is on the way but there is still a long way to go.

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12 years 1 month ago #414857 by billmckinstry
BRANZ had a good reputation years ago. Maybe it failed in more recent times.
My concern is all these little ideas put the cost of building up so much that NZ has one the highest house building costs in the world.
A few years ago, people could import a kit house from Australia and save money.

Our granfathers house didn't leak. Yes it was drafty but that was mainly due to lack of machined timber.

Get a house built in the 1920's. Insulate the walls and ceilings and underfloor and you have a great building.

New Zealand roofs seldom leak. The issue was the lack of eaves and maybe waterproofing the party wall on appartment blocks but houses built up to the 1970's were very good (subject to insulation).

A corrugated iron roof with good eaves lasts 30 plus years and easy and affordable to replace.

From the 1970's we started flooring our homes with weatbix and then we removed the eaves (smaller sections) and I gues we then got "smart" with our bathrooms and the rest is history...

Now we are told we Must Have double glazing no matter where we live. Northland or Southland. This just added $10,000 to the price of a family home and we wonder why there are homeless people.:(

If you can aford double glazing - go for it. If you can't then why does Nanny insist you must ?

Basic insulation is quite affordable and done at the building time makes sence but to insist on Double Glazing and now we must add a water tank[:0] to hold a few ltrs of rain water. Another $2,000 ??

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12 years 1 month ago #414862 by Rustie
Replied by Rustie on topic New Laws for Trademan ?
Can anyone tell me if renovations have to have double-glazing in them too? We're looking at getting some done to our place and were told that part of the room we're thinking of extending would need double-glazing which seems a little daft when the rest of the house isn't?!!!

Also, can anyone recommend really good architect, surveyor, builder and give me any information on tips and things to be wary of please? It's all so blooming confusing! :D

A good friend will bale you out of jail.
A real friend will be sat in there with you!

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12 years 1 month ago #414865 by foufee
Replied by foufee on topic New Laws for Trademan ?
not sure about a straight renovation but our extension which should start in a week or so requires double glazing to make the required R level or some such. We have exceeded the required insulation I think but not by enough to take out the double glazing. The rest of our house is a '70s build that had no insulation, we have done the walls but the ceiling is a nightmare and the floor is concrete slab.

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12 years 1 month ago #414868 by billmckinstry
My understanding is you can avoid Double Glazing by having the building reach a certain R factor, as above, but you may find the consultant fee to prove same to be higher then the cost of Double Glazing.
Double Glazing is well worth the cost, if you can afford same.

The most important part of a house to insulate is the roof. Consider removing the roof panels/tiles and insulte that way. May not be practicle but worth considering.
We did this on a property in Port Moresby and it proved quite easy.

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12 years 1 month ago #414869 by Rustie
Replied by Rustie on topic New Laws for Trademan ?
Thanks Foufee, we're looking at extending out too so it does answer my question. Seems funny really, our house is really old, has little insulation anywhere, what with the roof space being so small no-one wants to even quote for it! :rolleyes:

A good friend will bale you out of jail.
A real friend will be sat in there with you!

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