Boundary fence

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13 years 2 months ago #366102 by LongRidge
Replied by LongRidge on topic Boundary fence
We've had cows jump in with the bull, and then jump out again afterwards. Fence jumping isn't always done by males.

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13 years 2 months ago #366135 by Kiwi Sapper
Replied by Kiwi Sapper on topic Boundary fence

BRL;352981 wrote: You're absolutely right there Isla - it is illegal to electrify barbed wire. Not only that - it's totally unnecessary.


Interesting, but not my understanding which comes from the electric unit manufacturers who advise against using barbed wire, a resistance problem.

Could you please point to where you found the illegality?

Thank you.

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13 years 2 months ago #366136 by kate
Replied by kate on topic Boundary fence
We may be electrifing barbed wire soon so would be really interested in finding out if it's illegal as I didn't think it was.

It's a stretch of line high above a gully stream and inaccessable to stock. We will hang chain down from the wire, down to the water and they will (hopefully) prevent stock walking up or down the stream. We've been told to use barbed wire as the barbs keep the chain spaced out and stop them sliding together.

Web Goddess

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13 years 2 months ago #366141 by Ruth
Replied by Ruth on topic Boundary fence
I can find various bylaws which restrict or ban the use, but no actual legislative reference. I understood there was something somewhere, but perhaps it was simply the common sense recommendation as per some of the energizer manufacturer documentation which directs that no fence should be constructed and electrified such that any creature may become entangled in it!

Some of the bylaws do prohibit electric or barbed wires on boundaries.

We have some chain flood gates where the chain is attached to ordinary wire by tied wire and the chain stays where it should, despite regular flooding.

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13 years 2 months ago #366154 by powerguy
Replied by powerguy on topic Boundary fence

Kiwi Sapper;357362 wrote: Interesting, but not my understanding which comes from the electric unit manufacturers who advise against using barbed wire, a resistance problem.

Could you please point to where you found the illegality?

Thank you.

It is not a resistance problem. It is illegal to electrify barbed wire because the maximum energy put onto a fence is calculated on the skin resistance on contact. With barbed wire the skin can be penetrated and then you have a circuit involving a salty liquid (blood) which is a much better conductor. Under these conditions the same energy that is safe on skin can be FATAL and can stop the heart.[xx(]

From www.fencingcontractors.co.nz/Portals/525...s%20of%20Fencing.pdf page 29

It must be stressed that barbed wire should NEVER be electrified. Stock or
humans can be killed if they are unable to release themselves from an
otherwise safe electric fence, and the possibility of becoming entangled in
electrified barbed wire is too high to be safe. It is now illegal in New Zealand to electrify barbed wire.

This site is worth looking through if you are planning new fencing.

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Grid tie and off grid (stand alone)
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13 years 2 months ago #366156 by LongRidge
Replied by LongRidge on topic Boundary fence
Bylaws have more legal force than government legislation. They are in addition to the government regulations and usually clarify and tighten the government legislation.
Thus when fencing and planting trees, it is important to get the Council by-laws before you do the work so that you don't get asked to remove it. In our area, and I suspect others, fences must be at least 1 meter from the top or bottom of a road embankment, and at least 1 meter from the edge of the road, and on the boundary of the road reserve. I sold one of the council roads that was within my legal boundary to the council (got the grand total of $1 per square meter for a tar-sealed road), but we have another road that is fully within our property. With this, I have to fence 1 meter back from the edge of the road, and not on the boundary ..... and pay rates on the land that the road is on.
So check the by-laws as well as the regulations.

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13 years 2 months ago #366157 by LongRidge
Replied by LongRidge on topic Boundary fence
Bylaws have more legal force than government legislation. They are in addition to the government regulations and usually clarify and tighten the government legislation.
Thus when fencing and planting trees, it is important to get the Council by-laws before you do the work so that you don't get asked to remove it. In our area, and I suspect others, fences must be at least 1 meter from the top or bottom of a road embankment, and at least 1 meter from the edge of the road, and on the boundary of the road reserve. I sold one of the council roads that was within my legal boundary to the council (got the grand total of $1 per square meter for a tar-sealed road), but we have another road that is fully within our property. With this, I have to fence 1 meter back from the edge of the road, and not on the boundary ..... and pay rates on the land that the road is on.
So check the by-laws as well as the regulations.

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13 years 2 months ago #366238 by BRL
Replied by BRL on topic Boundary fence
In commenting that it was illegal to electrify barbed wire I'd taken my lead from FCANZ (Fencing Contractors Association) of which I'm a member. Regardless of the legality, as powerguy says - it's potentially lethal.

Kate - your application of barbed wire is a little different - it's going to be more than 800 metres inside your boundary, sit 2 -3 metres above a stream bed and will tie off to insulated end strainers before it reaches the banks, and have an energy limiter in the line as well.

If you really want to discourage neighbours stock putting pressure on a boundary with electric fencing - use 4.0mm wire (Number 8 in old terms) for the hot - it's the surface area on electric fence wire that carries the current and it doesn't get much better than 4.0mm - especially if you have a direct feed from the energiser straight to the boundary and can turn the rest of your property off. Electric fences are a psychological barrier - upping the belt reinforces the message for the offending livestock, it won't take long for them to show the fence some respect.

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13 years 2 months ago #366254 by Kiwi Sapper
Replied by Kiwi Sapper on topic Boundary fence

BRL;357472 wrote: In commenting that it was illegal to electrify barbed wire I'd taken my lead from FCANZ (Fencing Contractors Association) of which I'm a member. Regardless of the legality, as powerguy says - it's potentially lethal.......................................


I thank your for reply indicating your source . I have no disagreement with your views on the electrification of barbed wire and agree with you totally except for your earlier statement that it is "illegal."

Ill advised, unwise, unsuitable, inappropriate, unsafe, potentially lethal, impracticable, ineffective, even perhaps loony, but not illegal.

I argue, not with your knowledge or experience, only your use of a what to date, has not proven to be a correct word.

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13 years 2 months ago #366267 by FencerMan
Replied by FencerMan on topic Boundary fence
When I was being taught to fence (by professionals who do it as a day job) I was always told it was illegal as well.....

Do something.

Either lead, follow, or get out of the way.

'Ted Turner'

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13 years 2 months ago #366277 by powerguy
Replied by powerguy on topic Boundary fence

Kiwi Sapper;357488 wrote: I thank your for reply indicating your source . I have no disagreement with your views on the electrification of barbed wire and agree with you totally except for your earlier statement that it is "illegal."

Ill advised, unwise, unsuitable, inappropriate, unsafe, potentially lethal, impracticable, ineffective, even perhaps loony, but not illegal.

I argue, not with your knowledge or experience, only your use of a what to date, has not proven to be a correct word.

KS, if you follow the link in my earlier post you will see that the FCANZ states it is illegal. I would think it rather irresponsible for an industry body to disseminate false information so would tend to accept it is true.

When I managed a factory producing electric fence energisers I was informed at that time it was also illegal to electrify barbed wire.

Most things that can cause death to another person are illegal in this country. I have not stated all things simply because I am sure there is something the legislators have not thought of!

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13 years 2 months ago #366278 by Ruth
Replied by Ruth on topic Boundary fence
Tutu tea. [}:)]

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13 years 2 months ago #366304 by Kiwi Sapper
Replied by Kiwi Sapper on topic Boundary fence

powerguy;357512 wrote: KS, if you follow the link in my earlier post you will see that the FCANZ states it is illegal..................


I thank you for your response. I had noted the link and also your comments, however, the Fencing Contractors Association of New Zealand is not a "body" involved in the progression of legislation into New Zealand Law.

That is the role of either central or local government.

I recognise that there is a wealth of knowledge, expertise and experience amongst the members of the Fencing Contractors Association of New Zealand, of which no doubt you are either a current or past member, so would you be able to assist in clarifying this matter by naming the piece of legislation, be it either act, regulation, bylaw or whatever which makes it illegal?

I am aware of many pieces of local government law which preclude the installation of either electric fences or barbed wire within so many metres of a public boundary, passage way, right of way building, etc, but that are not relevant to this question.

As I have stressed earlier, I agree entirely with the point you make but I would be grateful to receive from you a pointer to that piece of "legislation" which makes it illegal to use barbed wire for the passage of current through an electric fence, before I am prepared to tell people that it is so.

I thank you in anticipation of the receipt of such information.

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13 years 2 months ago #366307 by busholme
Replied by busholme on topic Boundary fence
Case law and the Crimes Act 1962.
Forget the section but it relates to setting man traps.

30 - 50 Sheep, 6 chooks, 2 dogs, 1 cat and a wife - who wants highland cows, donkeys, ducks, alpacas etc [:D]

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13 years 2 months ago #366316 by Ronney
Replied by Ronney on topic Boundary fence
KS, why are you belabouring the point? Whether it is legal or illegal is immaterial, what is material is that it can be a dangerous and stupid thing to do and that seems to be well recognised. If it does happen to be legal to hot-wire barbed, do we really need another useless bit of legislation to tell us what we already know and what energiser manufacturers make quite clear?

Personally, I think the smart thing to do would be to just advise people not to electrify barbed wire if they have it on the grounds of common sense rather than legality.

I too understood that the hot-wiring of barbed was illegal.

Cheers,
Ronnie

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