ACC vs Sickness

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14 years 4 months ago #185634 by maggies mum
Replied by maggies mum on topic ACC vs Sickness
My teeth are aching just thinking about it! :(

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14 years 4 months ago #185637 by max2
Replied by max2 on topic ACC vs Sickness

maggies mum;157561 wrote: Aye, but if it's not classed as an accident and someone who needs treatment who doesn't have medical insurance, how do they pay??


This is going to sound mean, and isn't intended that way, but I find our health insurance cover expensive and we could really do with not paying it all, however to my way of thinking, its gambling with your (and your family's health) if One does not have some sort of cover....

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14 years 4 months ago #185659 by ccrk9
Replied by ccrk9 on topic ACC vs Sickness

The Kats Place;157558 wrote: Winz own doctor wrote a very strong letter to his case manager telling them that things would only ever get worse and not to send him for assessment again - and you guessed it - like clockwork the assessment forms arrived the next year with a very blunt letter saying get this done and returned to us by a set date or your entitlments would stop. The Doctor he needs to see is also the doctor of a super 12 (now 14) team so it is not always easy to get an appointment in the allowed time. He sees a specialist up at Waikato every three months, but he is not allowed to do the paper work even though he has a speciality in this area, it has to be the doctor they stipulate. The first couple of times it happened he sort of got his hopes up that he would get better - it was heart breaking to have to watch him go through the acceptance all over again.


Kats I would try and get an exemption from this crazy situation.

WINZ follow guidlines laid down under the relavent government legislation. However there is a key word in the legislation - discretion. Most of their policies have a discretionary clause where a case manager can go to head office and ask for an exemption to the relavent part of the legislation.

Get your sons Dr to do a letter laying it on really thick about the stress these Dr visits cause, re confirm his condition will not get better, and get a similar letter off his specialist. Make an appointment with the case manager and if possible the WINZ branch manager and request that they exempt him from this un necessary extra appointmet. Take copies of all previous paper work including the WINZ Drs letter re your son not needing a re assesment. They should take everything into account. The big thing to push at them is the distress this situation causes your son. The other thing I would do is take some sort of advocate with you - either from a support groupor from an organisation like CCS. Try and find someone who knows their way around the legislation. If you dont get lucky you could always threaten them with Fair Go as Fair Go have gone into bat for someone else who had a terminal illness - I just cant remember the circumstances. Also if you have a good MP in your area do a moan to him/her, or to the relavent minister - nothing a governemnt department hates more than a ministerial letter equiring into things[}:)]

The greatest fine art of the future will be the making of a comfortable
living from a small piece of land. ~ Abraham Lincoln ~

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14 years 4 months ago #185670 by The Kats Place
Replied by The Kats Place on topic ACC vs Sickness
I've made it my mission to sort out a few things in regard to my sons welfare this year so that will be one of them. Winz and ACC both will hate me by the end of it all. Another biggy they give us a hard time about is, Son had a fall a couple of years ago and fractured tib and fib in 5 places. This was a real challage with his illness as his cordination is poor so crutches where difficult. Anyway it healed but not well and left the injured leg a fraction shorter than the other. Because of his situation of the illness and the crutches thing it was decided not to operate to improve the leg (he doesn't get any pain from it). However he now doesn't walk 'straight' on that leg and wears out that side shoe really quickly, about every two to three weeks its new shoes. Winz says its the accident not the illness so ACC should help with the cost of the shoes. ACC say its the illness not the accident bla bla bla you get the picture. Do you think I can get the case managers from each place to have a conversation about it? Not a chance. This is another thing on my battle list.

kats
Live your life in such a way that it will be easy for people to say nice things at your funeral [;)]

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14 years 4 months ago #185674 by reggit
Replied by reggit on topic ACC vs Sickness
Directly to minister is the way to go if you are being given a hard time. Do it in writing, but expect quite a wait until you hear anything. Ministerial enquiries of any sort do rark up the troops [}:)] from experience, and tend to get things done, albeit slowly...

Take a break...while I take care of your home, your block, your pets, your stock! [;)] PM me...

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14 years 4 months ago #185822 by DiDi
Replied by DiDi on topic ACC vs Sickness
Helen Clarke went to to school in Te Pahu and was also Health Minister at one stage. Only mention is her anti smoking stuff but you could maybe catch her attention!

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14 years 4 months ago #185978 by Midge
Replied by Midge on topic ACC vs Sickness
I couldn't afford to pay for my meds if I had to as my fortnightly injection costs $2000. Myself and Rheumatologist had a bugger of a job getting 'special dispensation' from the Govt. to enable me to get it. I had to try combinations of all sorts of drugs which caused all manner of nasty side effects, before it was finally granted.

Prior to starting this new drug at the end of last year I had got to the stage where I had very little use of my hands and never ending terrible pain. Shame I had to wait so long for it, as in the meantime I've got so much irreparable damage to joints in my feet that they'll never be painfree and the distance I can walk is very limited.

IMO our health system should be putting more dosh into keeping the folk who want to work, well. In saying that, I prefer Labours health policies to Nat. anyday. I remember only too well when Nat. had us paying for specialists and most things medical - that was financially crippling!!

[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]Cheers[:)]
www.jerseycows.co.nz

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14 years 4 months ago #186010 by max2
Replied by max2 on topic ACC vs Sickness
Using your meds as an example Midge, and I don't mean to sound "mean", but One has to wonder what goes into the meds you need to take to jusify a $2000 fortnightly price tag.... and how much of that is actual profit to the pharmacatical company who manufacturers the product...

I am all for businesses making a profit, it is afterall what makes the world turn and keeps the economy moving, but somehow there has to be a "control" factor built into pricing for essential items (such as medications) that restricts how much the individual (and also the taxpayer) are asked to pay, without restricting the quality of life for the recipient.

Hope that makes sense!

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14 years 4 months ago #186032 by Midge
Replied by Midge on topic ACC vs Sickness
Drug must be made of hen's teeth and rocking horse poo Swaggie[;)]

I guess like most inventions, developers of new drugs have sole rights to manufacture and sell new drugs for a certain number of years. This allows them to recoupe monies spent on research and make a profit.

[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]Cheers[:)]
www.jerseycows.co.nz

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14 years 4 months ago #186053 by Kiwi303
Replied by Kiwi303 on topic ACC vs Sickness
don't forget as well, the cost of developing a drug can be over double digits in millions. add similiar amounts for FDA, Pharmac, the Euro drug agency and whatever else, and costs can be pretty horrendous.

You Live and Learn, or you don't Live Long -anon

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14 years 4 months ago #186087 by The Kats Place
Replied by The Kats Place on topic ACC vs Sickness
I know the cost of my sons medication is also horrendous and I do appreciate the subsidy we now receive for it. The first 3 or 4 months while we were waiting for approval we had to pay. Thank god we had medical insurance for him that we had since he was a child, before he became ill so he was covered. It was about $480 a week from memory. Now they just need to research a cure!

kats
Live your life in such a way that it will be easy for people to say nice things at your funeral [;)]

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14 years 4 months ago #186100 by max2
Replied by max2 on topic ACC vs Sickness

Kiwi303;158122 wrote: don't forget as well, the cost of developing a drug can be over double digits in millions. add similiar amounts for FDA, Pharmac, the Euro drug agency and whatever else, and costs can be pretty horrendous.


All businesses have start up costs, and they don't charge the first lot of customers to pay for those costs, its (usually) spread out over a period of time as part of the hidden costs of running a business as well as being a legal tax deduction and reducing taxable income, as well as giving the business a depreciation allowance.

I just think $2000 a fortnight is a bucket load to be asking anyone to pay to remain healthy and pain free.

There has to be room to be able to reduce the overall cost of this product (without subsidy) in the first instance, and if that "research and development" is factored into this item, then drop it and spread the cost across a cheaper more popular line (say panadol, disprin, cough and cold medicine etc) where the research dollar can still be recouped easily.

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14 years 4 months ago #186114 by organicltd
Replied by organicltd on topic ACC vs Sickness

swaggie;158172 wrote: All businesses have start up costs, and they don't charge the first lot of customers to pay for those costs, its (usually) spread out over a period of time as part of the hidden costs of running a business as well as being a legal tax deduction and reducing taxable income, as well as giving the business a depreciation allowance.

I just think $2000 a fortnight is a bucket load to be asking anyone to pay to remain healthy and pain free.

There has to be room to be able to reduce the overall cost of this product (without subsidy) in the first instance, and if that "research and development" is factored into this item, then drop it and spread the cost across a cheaper more popular line (say panadol, disprin, cough and cold medicine etc) where the research dollar can still be recouped easily.


Why should they?
Most people go into business to make money. With this money they provide for their family, provide employment for others, etc etc. On top of this, they have the risk of loosing it all at any stage.

So why shouldn't they recover the costs of their research asap. If the market didn't want their products at the price being charged, then the market is free to go elsewhere and get the same product. But if the product is new and innovative and is covered by patents then it is a different thing. Most patents run for 25 years I think. But there is a huge cost of getting to this stage. It all has to be paid from somewhere, mostly borrowed money.

Wine does not make you FAT it makes you LEAN...
....against tables, chairs, floors, walls and ugly people.

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14 years 4 months ago #186131 by The Kats Place
Replied by The Kats Place on topic ACC vs Sickness
If the cost of the medication provides more money for research that eventually leads to a cure then I'm all for it. I do however feel that the health system should assist those that can't fund the costs of these medications when needed. Herceprin (sp) for breast cancer should be right up there on the funded list!

kats
Live your life in such a way that it will be easy for people to say nice things at your funeral [;)]

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14 years 4 months ago #186143 by max2
Replied by max2 on topic ACC vs Sickness

organicltd;158187 wrote: Why should they?
Most people go into business to make money. With this money they provide for their family, provide employment for others, etc etc. On top of this, they have the risk of loosing it all at any stage.

So why shouldn't they recover the costs of their research asap. If the market didn't want their products at the price being charged, then the market is free to go elsewhere and get the same product. But if the product is new and innovative and is covered by patents then it is a different thing. Most patents run for 25 years I think. But there is a huge cost of getting to this stage. It all has to be paid from somewhere, mostly borrowed money.


I understand the theory of working a business Organicltd we run one ourselves in Aussie, a family business not a corporation so our food chain is a bit more closely related to our business's income than a director of a pharmacutical company.

Why should Midge's health and wellbeing be compromised because of the product cost?
Remember its not a "want" of Midge's but a need so Midge and others cannot go elsewhere with their consumer dollar to get their "fix".

If it was a car, TV or a new outfit I would certainly agree with you.

Surely the business on-costs such as ongoing research that push up that the price of $2000 could be distributed across a wider and cheaper variety of medications to keep the research funding going.... thus still generating income and profit for the companies involved.

If we work on the theory that pharmacutical companies should be able to recoup their expenditure and make profit immediately (or close to it) on a product such as Midges', then the same theory should be applied to student loans, housing loans etc.

And simply because its a health item it shouldn't be taken for granted that a business can and should charge a fortune for it and govt (taxpayer) should pay for it because its virtually someone's lifeline, that is blackmail.

There has to be a way to bring its cost down successfully for all concerned.

Corporate social responsibility shouldn't have to become law, but if that what it takes to make the medication affordable (if its proved to be comprised of substantial profiteering) then questions must be asked.....

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