DOC 2 shoot Arapawa Isld Goats-PETITION Pg.2 here!

[Andrea]

It's Dobiegirl who deserves the most credit here - she's been amazingly busy with it!

Andrea
Oxford

[Andrea]

I understand what you're saying, Suzanne, but I think the whole picture needs to be presented in the media before killings take place. That requires research which has never been done until now, and it's only just started (the DNA testing which proved that the Arapawas are a unique breed).

The goats occupy only 1/5 of the island and have never spread further than their present territory. It's in the nature of the animals (research on wild populations of goats indicates that they only go so far from their point of release). Betty has stated that in her own personal observations that the areas of the reserve inhabited by the goats have begun regenerating since all the sheep were removed. I know what damage goats can do en emasse, but the population there is rumored at being small.

This is another area which should be researched: what exactly is the population in the reserve? REAL evidence of the damage they are doing (photos sent from Betty show massive areas of thriving bush), and what specifically might be threatened by the goats. They are browsers after all, and by their nature will not denude a plant or area unless really pushed for feed.

They have been on the island for over 200 years, and may very well have become an integral part of the ecosystem. More questions which need to be answered.

Two days ago, I had two women from the English Goat Breeders Association visiting our farm, and admiring the conformation of the Arapawas and the Rawhiti English Goats (another feral herd from the N Island). Both women stated that the conformation of these goats is superior to what they have in the UK, and suggested the possibility of future semen importation to improve their goats! Something to these wild goats after all!


Andrea
Oxford

[Hestia]

If they are distinct in england,,,does england say something about this? are they coming in with facts and trying to do something?
Is england keen on getting some back home?
I feel as if it should be england that sends money and expertise to set up some kind of goat shelter and transport some of them back to UK,,

with england I mean the english version of DOC whatever that is.


am I totally wrong out or??

[Andrea]

There is a huge wave of support from the UK, with many of the protestors who've contacted government bodies in New Zealand representing rare breeds conservationists in the UK, and monies promised in the event of a muster.

The head of the UK version of Rare Breeds is assisting Betty Rowe with establishing a research project, but of the details, I don't know any yet.

I think Betty is really exhausted, as she's in her 70s and tires easily now.

I have just found this website with research (though a little biased, I'm sure) on feral goat populations in Australia:
http://www.nationalparks.nsw.gov.au/...eral_goats_ktp

This is the sort of thing that would be useful and more educational to see from DoC.

I happen to agree with what DoC stands for, just not its heavy-handed, blinkered approach to things.

I agree that there are more than likely plants and animals being challenged by the goats' presence in the reserve, which is why goats don't really belong in the reserve. However, as a unique species themselves, by virtue of 200+ years of island life, they deserve a chance to be brought out of the reserve and managed for the future.

Here's another titbit of info, from New Zealand, on how a feral population was handled some years ago (and is now unfortunately extinct):
http://rarebreeds.co.nz/auckgoats.html

Andrea
Oxford

[kalnetta]

I would like to add a comment .In the 1970 s a large number of the goats were brought to Christchurch along with some sheep.During and after the shift a lot of the goats died from stress some were sent to Banks Peninsula where most of them escaped and and thier decendants are now ferral and are considdered a pest.
So as anyone can see this battle has been going on for a long time.
There must be lots of so called endanged goats in captivity along with Arapawa Sheep.
I was involved in a small way with the initial rehabilitation and it was not a pretty sight to see all of the stressed animalsand I have had over the years doubts about the transfer of such animals over a long distance.

[Dobiegirl]

One of the things I find quite "interesting" or "disturbing" is the fact that DOC cannot say how many Arapawa Goats there are roaming around. Betty tells me that unofficially one DOC person told here when they were climbing the hills they saw 5 of the Goats and that they "heard" another 5.

I've questioned Betty about what she thinks the numbers are. She thinks its less than 100 and probably more around 50!

Now I find it surprising that if it only 50 goats that DOC are looking at culling, wouldn't it be easier to just try and catch them and rehome them.

I thought when all this started that there had to be at least 200+ goats that DOC were talking about - seeing as how they are such a "nuisance" and eating everything in sight (supposedly)!

Anyways - those of us who are working on the fundraising should be able to announce something soon and the Press/Media Release.

Thanks to all of you for your encouragement! It keeps us going!

[Inger]

My information tells me that there are no more than 300 - 350 of these goats world wide. Given that a stable population needs 500+ animals to ensure its survival, these goats are in danger of dying out if nothing is done to ensure numbers don't decline any further.

Suzzane, we're not disputing DoC's right to remove the goats from their reserve. We are merely asking that it be live-capture and that we be allowed to move them to more suitable locations, namely the people's properties who have volunteered to take them.

It is quite possible to domesticate young goats. We've done so ourselves. Once the goats have adapted to their new territory, they are happy to stay there. During this time, we tethered our goats. Now that they are used to their new home, they will stay within two paddocks of where they were tethered. We keep them with the rams, untethered and they are quite happy. The youngest neutered one is a pet and greatly enjoys the company of people.

[Toni - Northland]

Is there anymore news on what is happening now.

[Andrea]

Hi, Toni - check the other thread. The donations account number is listed there, as some people were asking about making direct deposits. The media release has gone out, and Betty has had some contacts based on this. Petition will be presented at Parliament soon, and hopefully there will finally be some actual communication.

Andrea
Oxford

[Andrea]

In case anyone's still following this, here's more recent information, including the transcript of the Parliament proceedings from when Gordon Copeland presented the petetion and questioned the MoC, Steve Chadwick

http://www.warmwell.com/arapawagoats.html

Andrea
Oxford

[Toni - Northland]

Thanks Andrea. Steve Chadwick isn't listening is he. I wonder if he has ever been to the island and had a look for himself. We have to keep on keeping on anyway.

[Andrea]

Steve is a she. Why she goes by Steve, I don't know, because it's confusing. I doubt she's been to the island (I'm finally getting to go next month, yippee!), but I just talked to a friend who spent last weekend with Betty, and she said the bush is SO thick that you can barely even crawl through it. If anything, the goats are keeping the gorse at bay so the natives can keep growing. Will be very interested in seeing what it's like for myself.

Cheers
Andrea
Oxford

[Toni - Northland]

We'll be looking forward to your first hand experience of the Island. Rellie just loves going there.

[Inger]

Can we have pictures Andrea? Everyone on here would love to see a bit of what Betty and her late Husband have organised there. I see the government hails it as a great tourist attraction for the area. How hypocritical is that ????????

[Andrea]

Well, not sure which post in which to put this latest, but I JUST had an email from Betty saying that she's had a phone call from DoC saying the cull is postponed till September, and that will allow our group to muster as many goats as we can! So, if anyone is prepared to help (I've had a few emails which I've kept track of) or adopt goats for certain, please let me know as soon as you can.

Cheers
Andrea
Oxford

[Toni - Northland]

Oh wow!!! I can't help pyhsically, but can only keep sending in the odd small donation. Hopefully it will help go towards the rescues. The letter writing campaigns must have worked, along with all the other hard work by lots of people in the background which we have to thanks them for. It's good to see DOC has come to the party.

[Pumpkingirl]

Andrea, could I suggest you put this in a new thread?

I think it deserves some yelling and whooping, especially for you and Dobiegirl and your tireless efforts.

I'd stopped coming in here to see what was going on, sorry about that

[beedee]

Please pat yourselves on the back, your irritating ways have done some good.. and I hope the groundswell continues to see that stevie and her wonder bunch dont get much sleep.. I will pm you

[Dobiegirl]

Hey Pumpkingirl - you deserve some kudos as well for your part in the Media Release, or did you forget all the hard work you put in!!??? writing up and editing, not to mention all the email addresses you supplied.....

A team effort I think with many others involved.